Thursday, October 13, 2022

Ortho-connery.

The truth is this war has its roots much further back than Obama. If you want to point to an incident as a starting place, it would be American involvement in the Balkan war during the Clinton years. American support for Kosovo against Serbia was the start of a new conflict with Russia. At the time, it was viewed in Moscow as a deliberate offense to the Russians. In the years that followed, this affair has become a warning for the Russians about what Washington plans for them.


One of the things about being of the right it is the desire to calibrate one's beliefs to reality. So its with some surprise that I read the above over at Z Man's blog. Quite simply its a revision of history.

Unlike the current situation in Ukraine, when the war in Yugoslavia started the American's did all they could to stop the country from breaking apart, including placing an arms embargo on the Croats, Slovenes and even the Bosnians. The Americans was so concerned about the stability of the former Soviet Union that they did not want to set a precedent by recognising the breakaway republics. Even the Baltics had a hard time gaining recognition from the U.S. The fact of the matter is that the Bush administration of the early 90's did all it could to support the continuity of the the former Soviet Union and turned a blind eye to much of the slaughter in the former Yugoslavia. The Republicans, for all their mouthings of liberty, did bugger all.

The entry of the Clinton administration initially didn't really change much. But it was the nightly reports of slaughter and murder, perpetrated mainly by the Serbs that turned public opinion in the U.S. and Europe against Serbian/Russian interests.  By the time the issue of Kosovo had come around, the largely accurate public image of the Serbs had taken such a beating that Serbian claims to Kosovo fell on unsympathetic ears.  American policy in Kosovo was designed to save lives and if the Serbians hadn't a policy of extermination I doubt that there would have been any intervention at all.

This of course bothered the Russians and their apologists who somehow felt that their right to dictate what happened in that theatre of operations trumped the human rights of the inhabitants of that region. What's really weird about this is that it was supported by large sections of the American "right".

While the fine detail of U.S. foreign policy towards Russia is beyond this blog post the fact of the matter is that U.S. Russian relations were quite cordial, even to the extent that Russia was mooted as a potential NATO member until the Orange Revolution where the Russians were outmaneuvered by the Americans, failing to get their man installed. (Unlike in Belarus.)

It's clear now that the U.S. is hostile to the Kremlin but it wasn't always this way and while both sides are responsible for this deterioration in their relationship. The way the Kremlin and their apologists paint it, one would think that the Russians were victims of exploitation instead of contributory agents. Putin is a Russian Nationalist with an imperialistic vision and his desire to restore a modern version of the tsardom is what rubs many people the wrong way and in the playbook of Russian diplomacy, when Russia doesn't get what it wants it is a "victim." 

While it is true that Putin's nationalism is in someways more "wholesome" than Western Liberalism in some ways it's far more rotten. Putin's anti-sexual-deviancy needs to be balanced by his disregard for the loss of innocent life. His appeal to family values has to be balanced by his blind eye to civic vices. What surprises me is just how many of the right are blind to them, or even worse, how many of them see as justifiable. From my perspective Putin's "badness" is a different "badness" to the "badness" of the West: But it is still bad.

Just as Neoconservatism wants to build a conservatism without reference to Christ, Orthoconnery wants to build a conservatism subordinated to Russian/Orthodox Nationalistic interests*. In this schema, the Church blesses whatever the State wants and reinterprets facts to further that narrative. The truth be damned. The idea that NATO is a threat to Russia is laughable as is the idea that Ukraine is a fascist state and so on.  The fact that many on the Western Right buy into this is a measure of how pitiful their understanding of when membership of the right entails.  i.e. a commitment to the truth and justice.

*Note: I'm not criticising legitimate Orthodox patriotism but its a patriotism that must be grounded in the truth.






19 comments:

Anonymous said...

Nope you're absolutely wrong in your return post. Ukraine is a fascist state abetted by fascists in Washington, brussels and your dumbass sovereign in London. NATO is an aggressive European conglomerate devised by the tyrannical lords of dc and london that should have died with the ussr. The covid response and the anti-freedom response of your government and your sovereign shows there is no good or morality to oppose whatever comes out of russia, Iran, China or India. Wjatever Christianity exists in the west is dead in leadership and should go down in flames. If that happens in ukraine, so be it.

jack said...

What I disagree with is the tendency to go too far back in history and root some conflict in something too early. Kosovo has relevance to this conflict but not THIS relevance. I.e. Serbia and Kosovo has the relevance that the US did to it what Russia is doing to Ukraine and the Leader of one of those countries recently pointed that out. Basically why did the West allow the US to destroy that country but Puton can't do that to Ukraine? Only the US gets to be a bully? That's the relevance of Kosovo, to point out a double standard.

Anonymous said...

“NATO is not a threat to Russia”

Yeah pull the other one

The Social Pathologist said...

@Anon

"Wjatever Christianity exists in the west is dead in leadership and should go down in flames."

If that's your position statement then this blog is not for you. I deliberately want to preserve what remains of Christianity in the West.

@Jack

Kosovo isn't a double standard. Serbia treated the Muslims in Kosovo dreadfully, prior and during the civil war. Indeed the Modern Serbian claims to Kosovo are open to legitimate dispute.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yugoslav_colonization_of_Kosovo

Sovereigns lose their right to govern over their peoples when there is systemic persecution of them. The fact of the matter is that Serbia, through its mismanagement abuse of the peoples under its jurisdiction set in motion the mechanism of disintegration. Serbian actions during the Yugoslav civil war made the possibility of Genocide in that region quite real. What was the West meant to do. Sometimes you have to give a helping hand.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/inatl/longterm/balkans/stories/refugees041799.htm

Were the French evil for helping the young Americans against the British, thereby breaking up "their empire?"

Anonymous said...

“Were the French evil for helping the young Americans against the British, thereby breaking up "their empire?"”

Yes. Clearly. If America had been smothered in the crib the world would be so much better now.

Anonymous said...

Fascist ukraine lost any claim to rule Russians after the 2014 coup. Russia is France supporting the independence against the genocidal aims of the fascist Ukrainian regime. You've described the situation from the Russian perspective. They are fighting the satanic west that fights for extortion, medical experimentation and non-reproductive fucking. At worst russia and the newly incorporated oblssts at least pretend to fight for a Christian future as opposed to your austrailia that fights for butt fucking as a sacrament.

Anonymous said...

While Serbs committed a lot of genocidal crimes in Yugoslavian wars, Serbia as a state didn't (commit genocide in Kosovo before start of the bombings). In Kosovo they committed brutal acts against the local population (including murder of civilians by order of the state) which can be compared to the acts of Turkey against Kurds. The more brutal and radical actions were taken _after_ bombing started.

The blatant hipocrisy of punishing Serbs while keeping eyes closed on Turkey and supporting Croats during cleansing of Krajina in 1995 is what turned off a lot of people in Central and Eastern Europe, not just Russia. The double standards (USA can wipe civilians weddings in other countries, while not even being at state of war with them, any other country would be declared literal Nazis for same thing) are offputting _even for people like me_, who in general see USA as allied state against Russia and who see themselves as naturally falling in Western camp.

(Indiction of Croat war crimes was later and was not publicised enough to reverse this feeling)

The Social Pathologist said...

While Serbs committed a lot of genocidal crimes in Yugoslavian wars, Serbia as a state didn't

Did you read that link in my above reply. I didn't say that that Serbians were genocidal I simply said that treated the Kosovars cruelly and unjustly before the bombings. They amped it up after the bombings. A people under unjust subjugation have a right to rebel. I mean the Americans broke off from the British for far less. I am also of the opinion that to help such people in such a circumstance is not only just but noble as well.

supporting Croats during cleansing of Krajina in 1995

Facts matter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Serbian_Krajina#/media/File:Martic-order1995.jpg

The idea that the Croats expelled the Serbs from Krajina is classic ortho-connery.i.e an attempt to re-write the narrative. Sure, there was no love lost with their leaving but it was a Serbian "own goal". Even Milosovic was disgusted with the speed at which they abandoned their positions.

The ICTY transcripts are out there even a cursory look at wiki will show that this narrative is wrong. Yet the lie keeps being repeated.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/canadian-army-chief-grilled-at-war-crimes-tribunal-1.717548

Dude, let me help you out.

https://www.icty.org/x/cases/gotovina/acjug/en/121116_summary.pdf

That the Americans and Europeans are inconsistent with regard to their commitment to human liberty is no news to anyone.

https://www.cfr.org/blog/remembering-iraqi-uprising-twenty-five-years-ago

You cannot be a man of the Right if you are not committed to the Truth.

Anonymous said...

Just like the people of the donbass and russian Ukrainians have every right to fight for their freedom from the fascist post 2014 regime. Russia has aided them against globohomo tyranny which you ignore. Almost like 2014 to Jan 2022 never happened.

Sean said...

"You cannot be a man of the Right if you are not committed to the Truth."

Physician, heal thyself

Anonymous said...

Back to globohomo deep state bs sources for the advancement of the globohomo finance empire. No truth in any of those idiotic sources. They could say water is wet and all would have to double check since all they do is write bs. NYT also said Iraq had wmds, leading to large amount of death and wasted money and only jones is sued because he helped fuck up their next war for 4 years.

The Social Pathologist said...

Just like the people of the donbass and russian Ukrainians have every right to fight for their freedom from the fascist post 2014 regime. Russia has aided them against globohomo tyranny which you ignore

Ortho-communnism is not the solution to globohomo, it's just another variant of it. That's my problem with it. The poisoning of the West's mind was mainly a result of the Russian -Soviet subversion of it. Remember, it's your guys that are still flying the Hammer and Sickle.

My position on the Donbass/Crimean region isn't as simpleminded and detached from reality as yours.

I'm aware that the majority of people there have expressed a wish to join Russia, but the way they have gone about it is utterly retarded. If I were Zelenesky I would give them the Donbass and Crimea with good riddance. As for Russia, this move has been disastrous. If it "wins" it will move further from Europe into the Asian sphere. How Europhile Russians will respond to this is anyone's guess but I can see it formenting revolution within Russia. If it loses it runs the real risk of breaking apart.

Believe it or not, Putin--had he played the game properly--could have positioned Russia as a bulwark against Western decadence.(and won over Ukraine) Instead he's set Russia up for a profound period of instability and instituted a ortho-commo decadence,which, while different in nature, is just as corrupting as the poison from the West.

Keep flying the Hammer and Sickle Comrade.



Anonymous said...

Don't fly the hammer and sickle but you sure fly the rainbow. You bootlick the commonwealth even during and continuing through the covid tyranny. If you support the globohomo regime in any capacity, you're not a man of the right. The donbass peoples have fought the tyranny of globohomo out of dc, london and brussels and their proxies. Communism doesn't exist like in the past though it does in the minds of compliant boomers. Globohomo is the tyranny and if Europe freezes, fuck them for following brussels.

Jason said...

I've enjoyed reading the analysis regarding Russia and Ukraine over your last few posts, although I wonder if a corollary should be addressed: where we in the West go from here. It seems to me that this might be the apposite time for America/Europe to push the two countries into making a deal (actually Macron might be the best candidate for being an honest broker here). Even though they are on the run in some ways, it's difficult to imagine that the Russians will ever accept Ukrainians retaking sovereignty over all of the country. It would be too dishonorable, for Putin or for any Russian statesmen, many of whom are to the Right of the current leader. Elon Musk got a lot of flak for his recent suggestions for peace on Twitter, yet they ring true to me: a Russian Crimea, and referendums for the autonomy or independence of certain eastern regions. Anything less risks painting Putin into a corner, where at best he continues to put the squeeze economically on the Europeans as they enter a cold winter, at worst takes the drastic step of using nukes. Give him a way out, especially as the exodus of his citizenry continues, which drip by drip erodes his authority and leaves him desperate.

The key, I think, is finding a way of guaranteeing Ukrainian security, likely encompassing the regular supply of high tech weaponry as well as generous economic aid to rebuild their country. Yet paradoxically the West will have to stress Ukraine's neutrality (like Finland during the Cold War) and espouse a hands-off attitude to a degree, acknowledging the special relationship Russia has with her "brothers" to the west (hardly surprising considering the way the two nations' histories overlap). This will be a bitter pill for the Ukrainians to swallow (I entirely sympathize considering Russian aggression), but really, what choice do they have?

Glad you're back doctor - hope all is going well with your practice, family, faith.

Anonymous said...

For good or ill, the Soviet period is the period where Russia went from a backwards agrarian footnote to an industrialized superpower that threatened to become the master of Europe, led a globally influential ideological crusade, and killed a bunch of animals by shooting them into space. Along with the millions of dead and the gulags there was a lot a national glory. As a reader of A. James Gregor, you know that the ideological regimes of the 20th century were really instances of "reactive developmental nationalism" that attempted to undue the national humiliation suffered by peripheral states through rapid industrialization. Hence the hammer and sickles in 2022.


Anonymous said...

Another brain dead, war mongering idiot in uk going down. All for the glory of the London bankers. Just like that scumbag johnson who scuttled the peace agreement you seem to advocate so zelensky proceeded to continue to fight for the glory of neoliberal globohomo. Hope finance shithead macron shows his tyranny once again and uses the military against "his" people and the results of following eu finance gangsters. Once the power of biden and the other gangster pelosi is done, the world can start to be free of dc, nyc, london and brussels.

The Social Pathologist said...

@Jason

I wonder if a corollary should be addressed: where we in the West go from here.

I think we're in a really difficult position here. As I see it, there are a few different agenda's at play. Firstly, the Ukrainians want their land back. Secondly, I think that the US wants to break up/weaken Russia and are "using" the Ukrainians as their proxies. I don't think that the U.S wants a peace deal and are urging Zelensky to fight on.

The problem for Putin, on the other hand, is that if he loses then the break up of Russia is a very real possibility. Not to mention the consequences for his own position. Reading between the lines, Putin seem open to some kind of negotiation but I think that the idiotic way he was conducted himself during this war-especially the opening phases--has closed that option with the Ukrainians.

I think that the Ukrainians are out for blood and any attempt by the West to reign them in will be seen as a kind of treachery which they would probably not accept. Their response to Musk I think is highly indicative of their mindset which I think was both ungrateful and stupid.

As for Macron, he's simply out the loop here.

As far as I see it, the least worst option would be for for a continual war of attrition from both sides with minimal movement of the front till exhaustion sets in, then some form of negotiated settlement could take place. The U.S. won't like this.

The U.S will continue to urge the Uke's on and arm them liberally. If the Uke's continue to win on the battlefield and cross the Dneiper, then I imagine Putin will use tactical nukes and things will get ugly. And then it will be a game of Chicken. Putin has everything to lose so retaliating against the West will be a real option for him. I think that the West will freak out but it won't risk nuclear escalation and then it will put the pressure on the Ukes. Putin will get the Donbass and Crimea, but Russia will be cut off from the Western world for the indefinite future. It will be pretty bleak for Russia then.

The other option is that Putin gets assassinated and Russia calls back the troops, but I don't think that this will happen.

I hope God has some other way out of this.

The Social Pathologist said...

@anon

Hence the hammer and sickles in 2022.

Germany did some pretty glorious military stuff under the banner of the swastika but I don't think anyone would excuse them displaying it or glorifying it as a statement of "national pride."

What always surprises me is how Communism gets a free pass despite killing more people than Fascism.

Anonymous said...

Lots of the purported atrocities committed by Russians didn't happen. For example the so called massacres by Russians who set up graves for their victims is nonsense.

Rather they are unburied Ukrainian soldiers who got buried in their respective grave.